“He Doesn’t Give a F***” About Mike McLusky – ‘Mayor of Kingstown’ Star Lennie James Teases New Gangster Character [Exclusive]

The Walking Dead star Lennie James has returned to mainstream television with Taylor Sheridan’s Paramount+ series, Mayor of Kingstown. The series is centered around Jeremy Renner’s Mike McLusky, a broker in a deprived city driven by its prison industry. McLusky is responsible for the Sisyphean task of maintaining peace between the police, prison guards, and organized crime.

In preparation for the third episode of Mayor of Kingstown Season 3, I had the opportunity to speak with veteran actor Lennie James about his new character, Frank Moses. Moses is a gangster from Detroit who arrives in Kingstown to establish his business. Though he presents himself as an amiable man, Moses shows what he’s capable of in the episode’s ending, ordering men to attack a rival gang with a flamethrower.

First, I just wanted to start with a more generalized question about the series. You once listed Hill Street Blues as your favorite show, you’ve also written for The Bill, and you’ve starred in Line of Duty, among others. Given your close relationship with these shows, what do you think Mayor of Kingstown brings to the Police drama genre?

Well, it’s kind of like a Don Quixote kind of modern-day story of someone trying to achieve the… something impossible, and so you’ve got Mike McCluskey navigating the prisons, the criminals in Kingstown, and the police. The three pillars of this society, and he’s trying to keep them from all ticking over and doing what they’re doing in a way that he can manage and doesn’t destroy his town and his family. And I think it’s a really, really interesting precinct drama, where the precinct is the town, and it’s three different areas, and I think it stands up. I think because Hugh (Dillion) based it on a place that he knows, I think as a premise, the premise is clear, and the premise is strong, and that leaves a lot of room for incredible situations and fantastic characters.

As for Frank, his primary focus has been on Bunny so far, but you had this tense, sort of introductory standoff scene with Mike McCluskey in the second episode. Frank is experienced; he’s probably dealt with fixers and brokers before, but Mike has this special esteem in Kingstown. How do you think Frank views the mayor? Is he an obstacle? Someone to use, something else?

I think Frank has done his homework. And I think Frank knows he doesn’t need to know who Mike McCluskey is to him, because he doesn’t, excuse my French, but he doesn’t give a f***. What he needs to know is who Mike McCluskey is for Kingstown. And who Mike McCluskey is to Bunny, because that’s what he’s gonna have to navigate if he’s gonna get what he wants. He’s a businessman, and he sees what he does as a business. He’s a venture capitalist. And he’s going in to take over a company, because there’s a space there, and there’s an opportunity there, and there’s a market.

At the moment, the market is not being served, so he’s gonna go in, and rather than build from the ground up, he’s gonna partner with an existing company, i.e., Bunny’s company, and he’s gonna grow it. So that it’s profitable, so he can leave it, let it work on its own, and he’d just take off his 30 or 40%, and keep his hands clean, because that’s how he gets the job done. So, Mike is part of the takeover, and he’ll keep him sweet for as long as he needs to keep him sweet, but if that doesn’t work, then you’ll have to find other ways of getting the job done.

Right. That’s kind of the perfect segue. It’s interesting what you said about keeping his hands clean as a businessman, but you also have this line in Episode 3 about knowing how and when to get your hands dirty. We saw that brutal train track execution scene at the start of the season. What do you think his relationship with violence is, and are there lines he won’t cross?

I think we’re gonna find that out. There’s only so much I can say about that, but I do think that violence is a necessary part of the job that he does, because he’s dealing with violent people, and it’s a violent profession. I don’t think it’s his first choice, but that doesn’t mean that it’s not one of his choices. And so far, if you’re up to Episode 3, when Frank opts for violence. i.e., the train track and the flamethrower, he doesn’t do it lightly. He goes full on. I wasn’t there when they filmed the flamethrowing scene, but I’m somebody who looks at stuff like that and goes, “They had to get a flamethrower.” They had to go to someone and go “Either buy a flamethrower or have it made.” I wonder at what point Frank went, “Yes, flamethrower, let’s do that. Let’s set them alight.” So he has to have okayed it, or come up with it, so he must be okay with it, and it’s my job to make him a man that you would believe that of.

It’s a fascinating angle to look at it with. He describes Bunny in one scene as someone who can give him a future, which I thought was interesting. (Frank) is offering him this deal, which, so far, seems to be quite generous to Bunny. But, like you said, he’s a businessman, so do you feel like this arrival in Kingstown is more about gaining something material, or how prevalent do you feel the psychological angle is for him?

I think that… Frank Moses would be a fool if he didn’t realize that his powers were on the decline. But he’s also someone who believes that he’s still capable of playing the game in a certain way, at a certain level. And I think that that’s what he’s trying to set up with Bunny. He’s trying to prove that he can still play the game at a level that makes him someone to contend with. And we’re about to find out what he’s willing to do in order to prove that point.

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You’ve dealt with survival shows with Jericho and The Walking Dead, and obviously, this isn’t dystopian in the same way, but there’s a similar atmosphere to Kingstown. What continues to draw you into these types of stories?

I think that they highlight… I think if you want to find something out, sometimes you have to take things to the extreme. I think that Kingstown feels like a storm. Feels like something apocalyptic, feels like there’s so much that’s going on.

If you were a regular working John in Kingstown, if you were a painter and decorator in Kingstown, someone who gets up every day and goes and paints houses, the things that you would have to step around, ignore, walk past, in order to keep being just an honest person, doing an honest job, trying to live an honest life, is almost impossible because of the climate and the atmosphere, and the realities of the place you live. So, I think that Moses feeds into it, knows how to operate there, knows how to live in it, and wants to take part in it. But for…the ordinary people, it tests them, and it is a way of kind of going, “How would I exist in this environment? What choices would I make? Would I have the strength or the determination to opt out, and if I opted in, who would I be?”

Frank has been introduced in the series as this very archetypal force; people know him; he has a reputation. Given your experience as someone who’s performed on the stage and done Shakespeare and written plays of your own, how does the acting process change when you’re tackling a character who’s larger than life in that way?

I’m not sure that the process changes that much, really. I was lucky that Frank comes with a reputation and history, so I can use those facts to build the man. But I think that the basic rules of engagement don’t change. “What is true about my character? What do other people say about my character? What does my character say about themselves? How are they related to the story? How are they related to the other characters in the story?” And somewhere in there is the beginnings of your character, and I think that’s true whether it’s the stage or on film, really. I think you ask the same questions. You just might have to get the answers from slightly different places.

It seems like you’ve thought this all through, and you know this show like the back of your hand.

I mean, I was lucky because I was a fan of the show before it started. I mean, I was a little behind in my watching, but I, I had…watched it right from the beginning, and then work got in the way, and it was my intention to go back, and then I had an excuse, because I was offered a part in it. So, I was at an advantage.

Release Date

November 14, 2021

Network

Paramount+

Directors

Stephen Kay, Guy Ferland, Christoph Schrewe, Clark Johnson, Paul Cameron, Tasha Smith, Taylor Sheridan

Writers

James Arcega Tinsley